Workouts in general

[Sandreadis]

MG, The horse was running against a double bias,slow pace and speed favoring track.He only got beat a length with a very compromised running style.
I\'m not sure why you wouldn\'t consider this turf race in evaluating this horse for the KD.
Big Brown and Barbaro\'s turf races preceding the Derby, were very big pieces to their puzzles.

[jbelfior]

Turf racing is all about late speed. What made Barbaro and Big Brown\'s turf debuts impressive was their abilty to carry their  speed on turf. They also went into the Derby off of a Grade 1 win on dirt.

Good Luck,
Joe B.

[MO]

And that\'s not necessarily a bad thing. BB/TEB exacta paid $143.00. TEB was 4th choice in the betting.

[Funny Cide]

It\'s tacky to say things like that about your competitor (who also mentored you so that you could make your own figures later).  Both are good products.

[TGJB]

Funny-- just for the record, the last thing Ragozin did was mentor me. I did not do track speeds for him, and he was hostile to anyone who had success using his data, as I did, with the exception of Friedman. And anyone who was there will tell you the same thing.

[Silver Charm]

TGJB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ragozin... was hostile to anyone who
> had success using his data, as I did, with the
> exception of Friedman. And anyone who was there
> will tell you the same thing.

Please clarify this. Friedman was the only person who was successful using his data besides yourself or Friedman was the only person who was successful and he was not hostile towards.

[TGJB]

The latter.

[sekrah]

That BB exacta was a fluke.

Funny Cide won at 12-1 on top of Empire Maker and it didn\'t even reach $100.
Street Sense 9/2, Hard Spun 10-1 barely paid $100.
Smarty Jones/Lion Heart paid $65.


A Esky/LAL or Esky/SC ticket will pay $40 if you\'re lucky.

[Wrongly]

How about these:
1999 Charismatic (31/1) with Menifee (13/1) = $728
2001 Monarchos (10/1) with Invisible Ink (55/1) = $1,229
2002 War Emblem (20/1) with Proud Citizen (23/1) = $1,300
2005 Giacomo (50/1) with Closing Argument(70/1) = $9,815
2009 Mine that Bird (50/1) with Pioneer of the Nile (6/1) = $2,075

Tossing the favorite this year?

[sekrah]

Now that\'s what I\'m talking about.   Yes toss Esky.

[analizethis]

Interestingly now we have another likely KD winner (Eskendereya) who also started his career on turf. I know there are more opportunities for two year olds on turf than there used to be but is there something else going on here pedigree wise to which we need to pay attention?

Maybe the only breeding for classic distances takes place with \"turf\" sires and/or broodmare sires.

[miff]

Many non turf bred 2 yr olds start their careers on turf because they train like elephants on dirt.

[mjellish]

There aren\'t a lot of longer, 2 turn dirt races available for 2 year olds.  So if you\'ve got a 2 year old that looks like they want a route of ground, often the trainer will run them on the turf.