hollendorfer

[shanahan]

opinions on this trainer?  TBT readers view him 50/50 as good /bad/runs \'em ito the ground,...I don\'t know but looks like he has a top filly in training.  Can you run them that young 3 times in 28 days?  Or can you run a great one at GG 3 times in 28 days?  Opinions please on strengths/weaknesses

[Rick B.]

My opinions:

* Always hard to toss.

* Deadly when a price (5-1 or more), or not using Baze.

* Rides almost anybody these days; don\'t get fooled, he\'s trying to win.

* If he enters two, neither are out for air -- box \'em.

* If another trainer claims from him, they won\'t run for the new guy.

[covelj70]

I have very limited experience with Hollendorfer but what I can tell you is that the 1 filly he trained for me ran her best numbers while she was with him and that Mott never got the filly to run the same numbers that Hollendorfer did.  

That said, she was pretty banged up by the time she left his barn and came to the farm in pretty bad shape underscoring the idea that he is very hard on the horses.

very limited info but I figured I would pass along for whatever that is worth.

Happy Holidays

[JimP]

Which one got the most wins/start and most money/start for you?

[covelj70]

Hollendorfer got the most wins and money per start by a longshot (she never won with Mott even though she had alot more starts with him) but as a TG\'er, I am less concerned with wins than I am with figures.

If Mott would have won more but the filly ran better figures with Hollendorfer but didn\'t win (wide trips, etc), I would still say Hollendorfer did a better job.

That\'s a more philosophical point obviously and an irrelevant one since she did better on the track with Hollendorfer.

[martoon]

Jim.. can you share who\'s been most effective trainer for you outside these mentioned?  Not necessarily just figs but soundness,  owner communication with trainers etc..   Also not to pry but since you are a prominent owner-player here, have you had a better 2010 owning them or playing them?  Seems like you\'ve had a great year.  Here\'s to even better in 2011 !  cheers!

[shanahan]

thanks, all...I think I stay away as an owner then, but it sounds like he\'s a reincarnated DWL on the young ones...I am looking into 2YO for the first time, and am hell bent on patience.

[martoon]

Hey Shan...  these things are so fragile they can go bad no matter how patient you are.and I\'ve found they can go sore from these trainers who patiently gallop them into submission for months on end just as easy as the guys who like to get them breezing early. I think a lot of the problems come up when they push them through the warning signs of obvious soreness etc... as opposed to just the style or speed of the workouts.  

It also depends on your stock.  If you have cheaper stock sometimes it\'s better to get an idea early if they have any talent with some earlier breezes to get a read of your horse\'s class and worth..  Otherwise some of these trainers will gallop them for 10 months then breeze them for months - then inform you your animal is dead fit but isn\'t a standout and want to go in a nickel maiden claimer after racking up a \"patient\" $30K training bill...

Most important thing I think is to find a competent trainer who doesn\'t train daily with the vet.  Those guys who send you monthly 4 figure vet bills just for routine training are the ones that will turn you off of ownership in a hurry.

[miff]

Patience is somewhat a myth,sounds nice.Most important thing is luck and the ability/resiliency of the animal. The more you are around horses as an owner,the less you will be impressed by any trainer.


Mike

[alm]

Agree that luck comes first, but having had a pretty wide experience with trainers I feel that there are a handful who stand out...it\'s not just statistics either...it\'s about honesty and communication...rare commodities, but existent nevertheless.

It took me 15 years to find someone who can bring a baby to the track without damage...it took me about 20 years to find someone who can handle them at the track without wearing them down.  But I have found them.

If you are looking at this as an owner, the qualities you seek are different than what you want in a trainer you are betting...for what it\'s worth, IMO Hollendorfer is about as good as they get for betting.  He\'s an elite trainer in that regard.

[sighthound]

\"It took me 15 years to find someone who can bring a baby to the track without damage...it took me about 20 years to find someone who can handle them at the track without wearing them down. But I have found them.\"

I think that says it all.  And is a much deeper and more astute statement than it appears superficially.

You can not hothouse and coddle young horses, they need to gallop and work or they won\'t develop their heart, lungs, bone, tendons.  Use it or lose it.  If we eliminated 2-year-old racing, we\'d increase the breakdown rate astoundingly.  It would be a bloodbath.

That said, I agree most trainers are unimpressive.  Yet there are indeed very, very good ones, good horsemen, good with knowing when to press, when to back off on a young horse.