dumb weighters ny post page3

[Kasept]

Why not do some research before concluding \"betting coup\"?

It was such an involved \"scheme\", that on two of the overweight incidents, THE JOCKS IN QUESTION WON RACES AT SARATOGA...

On 8/22 in the 9th, Corny Velasquez is alleged to have \"rode the number eight horse in race nine at SRC to completion\". In said race, C. Velasquez managed to pilot Evening Attire (7-1) to a 5 length victory over Funny Cide (1-1) and Bowman\'s Band (4-1) in the Saratoga Breeders Cup Handicap...

On 8/25 in the third, Robby Albarado is alleged to have \"rode the number four horse in race three at SRC to completion\". In said race, R. Albarado managed to bring Shadow Cast (6-1) in first in a 9f O/Alw Clm over Cloak of Vagueness (1-1) and Childress (5-2)...

Wow... Pretty clever conspiracy. Overweight the mounts and win anyway!

I\'d also like an explanation of how Albarado was overweight on 8/21.. He carried 118 in the 5th (7th on Maharishi at 18-1) and 117 in the 6th (7th and last on Ginny\'s Queen at 9-2, third choice). Both races are cited in the indictment. But 25 minutes later in the 7th, Albarado was again at 118 when he won a $100k Opt Clm on Midway Road. THAT race isn\'t cited.

This entire fiasco is the work of one person at NYRA who must have thought he was Karen Silkwood. The fact that Mario and Braulio both were kept on salary while suspended tells you everything you need to know.

Here are the cited transgressions from last year\'s Toga meet...

Date, Race #: Rider, Finish-Horse (Trainer) Odds:

8/16, 1st: Castillo, 9th Anat (Cuandra) 53-1
8/16, 2nd: Albarado, 7th Musha Cay (Walden) 23-1
8/16, 4th: Albarado, 4th Woodlander (Albertrani) 11-1
8/16, 6th: Albarado, 3rd Contagious (Young) 4-1
8/16, 7th: Castillo, 5th Race For Glory (Lukas) 31-1
8/16, 8th: Albarado, 10th Vanity Affair (Stoklosa) 11-1

8/19, 3rd: Castillo, 6th Punchout (DeMasi) 16-1
8/19, 6th: Smith, 3rd Command Center (Gyarmati) 14-1
8/19, 6th: Castillo, 9th Cuse (Trimmer) 35-1

8/21, 5th/6th: Albarado as cited above

8/22, 1st: Castillo, 2nd Renamed (Pederson) 11-2
8/22, 8th: Albarado, 6th Strategy (McGaughey) 5-2 * beaten favorite
8/22, 9th: Velasquez, 1st Evening Attire (Kelly) 15-2
8/22, 9th: Albarado, 4th Alumni Hall (Howard) 7-1

8/23, 3rd: Albarado, 2nd Tap\'n Tango (Lukas) 2-1 * 2nd choice
8/23, 3rd: Smith, 6th Miss Discover (Parisella) 52-1
8/23, 6th: Smith, 4th Thirteen Mil (Ferraro) 70-1
8/23, 6th: Albarado, 8th Yankee Magic (Dutrow) 11-2 * 2nd choice

8/25, 3rd: Albarado, 1st Shadow Cast (Howard) 6-1
8/25, 5th: Velasquez, 2nd Family Business (Stewart) 3-1 * 2nd choice
8/25, 5th: Albarado, 5th Amanuensis (Vestal) 8-1

8/26, 2nd: Albarado, 6th Burmese Cat (Stewart) 8-1
8/26, 3rd: Albarado, 4th Vibs (Romans) 20-1
8/26, 4th: Albarado, 4th My Hidden Storm (Matz) 30-1
8/26, 9th: Castillo, 3rd Land of Dreams (Feron) 9-1

8/27, 1st: Castillo, 9th Desert Patrol (Lukas) 43-1
8/27, 6th: Smith, 2nd Veiled Speed (Contessa) 19-1 * debut
8/27, 6th: Albarado, 3rd Straw Hat (Howard) 11-2

8/30, 2nd: Velasquez, 5th Datts Joesrainbow (Serpe) 48-1
8/30, 6th: Albarado, 5th Parading Tomisue (Howard) 27-1
8/30, 6th: Santos, 12th Ohbeegeewhyen (K. O\'Brien) 24-1


This whole thing is so disgusting that it\'s hard to believe. To ruin two men\'s lives over this, one a Hall of Famer that\'s beloved by everyone in NY no less, is pathetic.

[miff]

Kasept,

Great post!! Like I said HP, you know more than Elliot Spitzer about NYRA racing.

[MO]

You mention Cornelio V beat Funny Cide. Was Santos aboard Funny Cide? Was FC favored? Was Santos overweight?

If one bettor made $2 because of this info, then it is a coup. INTEGRITY is not subject to \"a wink is as good as a nod to a blind horse\". You are honest, or you are not. THERE IS NO MIDDLE GROUND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[MO]

Kasept wrote:

\"This entire fiasco is the work of one person at NYRA who must have thought he was Karen Silkwood. The fact that Mario and Braulio both were kept on salary while suspended tells you everything you need to know.\"

Care to let us in on the mystery person?

[HP]

Miff,

Don\'t try to hide your smug and worthless initial assessment of this behind Kasept\'s detective work.  The jockeys are \"unindicted co-conspirators\" at this stage and no one is disputing that the weights were fudged.  An intelligent and humble person would say, \"let\'s wait and see what happens when the initial fireworks are over.\"  Jockeys talk.  Some of them bet.  At the very least, this bears further investigation.

Plus, it wasn\'t ME who said that there was or wasn\'t any betting coup.  I will leave that to the other \"experts\" like you and Chuckles.  

You were the one who weighed in on that with the insta-uninformed opinion, which you were happy to make out like it was available to you via \"what you heard at the track.\"  Okay, Mr. Insider?  If you feel happy about your posts here, more power to you...  Anybody can read them...  

I feel pretty sure that Spitzer would not frivoulously ruin people\'s lives (they are looking at seven years in jail) and I will not let your nonsense interrupt my dinner...  

HP

[BitPlayer]

I could swear this type of thing was also discovered in Chicago a few years back.  The following, from the Thoroughbred Times in 2001, was all I could find through Google:

Arlington Park Clerk of Scales Conrad Enrique has been shifted to the position of placing and patrol judge after a spot check by the stewards before the running of the Hanshin Cup (G3) on July 7 revealed that five of the eight jockeys weighed between two and five pounds more than their published weights.

Among the jockeys was Robby Albarado, who went on to win the race on Bright Valour. He weighted 119 pounds rather than the assigned 115. The other jockeys were Eusebio Razo Jr., who finished second on Apt to Be, Carlos Silva, who was third on Castlewood, Eddie Martin, and Ramsey Zimmerman.

The stewards fined each of the riders $100 and, when racing resumed Wednesday after two dark days, Assistant Racing Secretary Jack Bubolz replaced the reassigned Enrique as clerk of scales.

In a statement announcing the changes, Arlington Chief Executive Officer Scott Mordell said, \"Though we do not believe that our employees acted improperly we are immediately realigning the employee responsibilities in our racing department to alleviate any potentially adverse perceptions.\"—Neil Milbert

[MO]

{In a statement announcing the changes, Arlington Chief Executive Officer Scott Mordell said, \"Though we do not believe that our employees acted improperly we are immediately realigning the employee responsibilities in our racing department to alleviate any potentially adverse perceptions.\"—Neil Milbert }

I love the part: We do not believe our employees acted improperly.

No, it was .... a ghost! Yeah, that\'s it! A ghost named.... Casper. Yeah - that\'s it!! Casper the friendly ghost.

[miff]

HP,


I\'ve read your and uncalled for nasty and often belligerent posts aimed at several people on this board many times before. Anytime, anyplace AO, I\'m not anonymous.

[Chuckles_the_Clown2]

Miff, knew you\'ve been involved by your posts and pay attention to your insights.

The numbers are on about a four to five year faster trend. Do you think drugs in racing. Perhaps even new drugs help explain it?

During this same time period we\'ve had the appearance of the \"Supertainers\" too. Seems all far too coincidental to me.

I\'m not as big a believer in the \"horses will tend to pair\" theory. I know TGraph relies upon data for that. Just think big wins or unexplainable losses call for close scrutiny in figuring tough races.  It does appear tgraph is factoring comparative placing in the race more prominently now and resolving anamolies with Pair Probability.


miff Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Chuck,
>
> You missed the point I have been driving at all
> along. For about 17 years(I do not remember
> exactly)or more I have been buying TG.During the
> past few years I feel the product has changed. I
> tried to figure out why and I did comparisons with
> other similar products,but still no answers and
> only more questions.
>
> About three years ago, I FIRST came to this site
> and began to read some of Jerrys latest thoughts
> and theories, I knew the old ones.Some I agreed
> with and some I had serious problems with.In
> seeking answers to what I felt was a \"changed\"
> product, I felt that maybe Jerry was beginning to
> let his personal beliefs slip into the figs.
>
> Faster and faster figs,and many more \"ugly\"pairs
> were my main problems.  Comparable products were
> not showing the same thing to the same degree, if
> at all.I had also heard that pairs were given out
> \"as a matter of course\" at TG,but I did not
> believe the source that told me.
>
> I thought I addressed my concerns to Jerry in a
> respectful way only to be spoken \"down\" to as if I
> had just started to buy the product and just
> learned the game and in a how dare you mode. The
> more I read the more I was convinced that maybe
> the current figs could not be interpreted/relied
> upon by me as before.
>
> I have no problems with Jerry having his
> theories/opinions as long as he does not let them
> \"bias\"his figure making.Let the horses run the
> figs, period.

[HP]

Miff,

If you consider my review of your posts \"nasty and belligerent\" maybe you should re-read some of YOUR posts.  Did I misquote you or mis-state your comments?  

Your implied threat is truly terrifying.  If bulletin boards get you so excited, maybe you should find another way to get off...    

HP

[Chuckles_the_Clown2]

Im beginning to believe this that this case is based upon the weigh ins vs. the weigh outs which was done on different scales. NYRA supposedly took the matter to investigators and beginning to believe it was on the weigh in vs. weigh out discrepancies.

You\'d think they\'d need testimony though......puzzling




MO Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Kasept wrote:
>
> \"This entire fiasco is the work of one person at
> NYRA who must have thought he was Karen Silkwood.
> The fact that Mario and Braulio both were kept on
> salary while suspended tells you everything you
> need to know.\"
>
> Care to let us in on the mystery person?
>

[miff]

Chuck,

No one has been caught with the magic bullet yet so it\'s only suspicion. Having said that, I think guys are cheating. I get back to why we have not seen many more freakish performances in raw terms. There are certainly many very fast horses running all the time and it would seem if they are supposed to be 10 lengths faster(as Jerry feels)we would see 1:06\'s at 6f or 1:18\'s at 7f etc.It ain\'t happening.All I see is TG, Rags, Beyer and Brisnet disagreeing too widely and too often.

Jerry talks about the cushion being at 4in. now as opposed to 2.5in.years ago, but no one can say with certainty that tracks are slower although logically it should follow.Why I am suspect about the 4in. cushion thing is because during a recent period at Belmont the cushion was posted at 4in. for 8 consecutive racing days and raw times for similar runners on successive days varied by 5-7 lenghts.So what does a posted cushion of 4in. really mean??I guess wind, moisture, sun etc play havoc.

From the above, you could reason that the 2.5in cushion of years ago may have been all over the place also.Very unscientific this cushion thing.

[MO]

Are you suggesting that one scale was working properly and the other was not? Hmmmmmmmmmm, I could see that as a possible scenario, especially if union labor was involved.

[Kasept]

MO..

Santos WASN\'T on Funny Cide that day.. He was nursing an injury and Prado was on board.. Cide was indeed the public choice..

And no.. I don\'t care to name the mystery person that initiated this enormous \"monkey f------ a football\" mess..

And if the weigh in/weight out scales were out of whack, it would register discrepancies on ALL the jocks.. Not just the chubby ones.

[MO]

Well that seemingly clears up one race. Now regarding the other 66..........

But a closer look into how the scales are calibrated, when and by whom is definately warrented. I get on them all the time and I have NEVER in my 18 years of employment ever seen a scale technician at work. Furthermore,  I question the accuracy of these scales. I know that my horn weighs about 3 1/2 pounds, but when I put it on the scale all by itself, it weighs zero. Perhaps all race tracks should go to a digital scale instead of the traditional, sentimental favorite from the Norman Rockwell portraits.