Recaps and Rants

[richiebee]

Spent most of Saturday in a family mode, so did not have much time to watch/bet
the proceedings at the Gulf.

The one race I did watch/bet, the G III Appleton, resulted in an immediate
addition to my DRF \"watch list\". Monument Hill, trained by Weaver and ridden by
Maragh, had a rougher trip than Ted Kennedy at Chappaquidick. Also, haven\'t been
betting GP enough to comment (only to question), but Monument Hill was 7/2 on the
morning line, 17/1 with 12 minutes to post, went off at 11/1.

In the Florida Derby,if I fancied Union Rags as a Derby winner going in, I did
not see anything which would upset me regarding his Derby hopes--he seemed to be
running well at the end. Matz worked this one rather slowly heading into the Fla
Derby, expect to see more zip in the morning getting closer to Derby Day.

As to the winner, good call by our host, but will TCI get the same pace/rail trip
in Louisville that he got at Hallandale?

UnFair Grounds (Sunday). Studied quite a bit during the week on the P4 which
ended with the La Derby. The result of all my study was a 4/4/4/4 $.50 ticket
which did not have a winner on it. Brilliant!

Ranting: As reported in the New York Post and the Daily News Saturday, and by
Matt Hegarty in DRF today, New York has adopted a rule similar to California\'s
rule which voids claims on euthanized horses. New York has also decided to make
information on catastrophic breakdowns and vet listed horses more accessible to
the public.

With regard to the claim voiding rule, do not understand the approach. The idea
is to prevent catastrophic breakdowns. This rule will not directly accomplish
that objective. To me its as if Iran and Israel sit down to negotiate to prevent
hostilities, and begin the conversation by saying \"Let\'s discuss post war
reparations\". Some better ideas for preventing catastrophic breakdowns might
include (some of these have been discussed here):

a) NOT enhancing purses at the bottom levels (as discussed by JB).

b) Raise the \"bottom\" to 15K at Aq and Bel, 20K at the Spa. Raising the bottom
from 7500K to 10K will have minimal impact. These steeper raises will also have
the effect of eliminating an entire class of inexpensive horses which do not
belong at NYRA anyway. Once this rule has been implemented, stalls should not be
given to non- maidens which have not won at the new bottom in the last (3)(?)
(6)(?) months.

c) Barring animals which have been vet scratched/vet listed multiple times.

As to the publication of information, I\'m all for transparency.

[sighthound]

>>> With regard to the claim voiding rule, do not understand the approach.

It prevents an unscrupulous trainer putting an animal in a claiming race, knowing the animal has something going on that might give away literally during the race.  The guy who thinks to himself, \"Hey, who cares of the horse breaks down mid-race, I\'ll have the claim money and the other guy has the dead horse.\"

It helps, IMO.

[yankndixie]

sight,how does that help the horse? the rule only protects the person claiming the horse

[sighthound]

Hopefully it prevents the unscrupulous trainer from choosing, for a horse that has a career-ending problem, to allow that to happen back at his barn - not on the track at someone else\'s expense, while he gets a few thousand out of the deal, too.

There are trainers that know a horse has a problem that may cause the horse to break down and fall it\'s next gallop.  Those are the guys this rule is targeting. They choose, not to euthanize it, or find it a home, or a pasture to live it\'s life out in, but to drop it and enter it in a claiming race to get a few thousand out of it\'s racing career end, knowing perfectly well it may break down during the race.

The appalling thing is the disregard for the lives of the jockeys.

This rule change makes doing that a zero-pay proposition, plus the trainer will pay for the euthanasia on-track, and disposal.

[Beginner]

I came across Monument Hill while enjoying New Year\'s Day holiday (1/2).  I randomly noticed (very randomly as I was literally clicking through equibase.com) that he was owned by a friend\'s family...so I bet him (heresy on this board, I know).  I added him to Thorotrack and bet him in the Appleton in a tri-box but I had Brilliant Speed in the mix.  I don\'t think he\'s finished off the board in the last 15 or so races.  The owner flew down from NY Saturday morning to watch him and the FL Derby.  Nice work if you can get it...

[richiebee]

sighthound Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> There are trainers that know a horse has a problem
> that may cause the horse to break down and fall
> it\'s next gallop.  Those are the guys this rule is
> targeting. They choose, not to euthanize it, or
> find it a home, or a pasture to live it\'s life out
> in, but to drop it and enter it in a claiming race
> to get a few thousand out of it\'s racing career
> end, knowing perfectly well it may break down
> during the race.

All of the \"trainers that know that a horse has a problem that may cause the
horse to break down and fall\" retain veterinarians. Are you saying that the
trainers are aware of these problems but their veterinarians aren\'t? In these
cases it looks like the veterinarian\'s loyalty is to (first) their human clients
and (second) their equine patients. Sad, and in the long run, unsustainable.

[sighthound]

No.  I\'m saying the vet tells the trainer, \"Here the problem. It\'s XXX. He can\'t run with that, because running him may cause the problem to exacerbate, he could even break down.  He needs:  fixing, time off, retirement, etc.\"

So here\'s a horse that worth nothing.

And the unscrupulous trainer - who knows the horse has a problem that could lead to a breakdown if run - deals with it by putting the horse in a claiming race.  The vet has no control over that.  Let alone even any knowledge of it.

And yes, this is rare among trainers, but exists.  Hence the rule that if a horse breaks down and is euthanized, the claim doesn\'t stand.  It\'s a good rule, IMO.   It will help prevent ethically bankrupt trainers from disposing of known cripples through the claim box.

[SoCalMan2]

I think we should establish a stickie or whatever it is called for the greatest lines that come up in this forum.  My nomination for the first such greatest line is RichieBee\'s -- a horse having a \"Rougher trip than Ted Kennedy at Chappaquidick\"

[magicnight]

Not as bad as Mary Jo\'s trip, I reckon.

[miff]

NYSRWB enacted the new rule for 90 days over the strong objections of the NYTHA(Horsemens Group)Assume the rule will be extended and think it helps players too.See Bloodhorse article.

A sudden rash of pre race scratches at Aqueduct, back some 7-8 racing days ago, confirms to me that horses who were \"passed\" before are now being rejected for racing. A NYRA vet said categorically that there is no new criteria for vetting horses for racing soundness.I don\'t believe that.

Ranting on NYRA requires equal time on the other side.For whatever reason, NYRA is now looking at transparency issues favorable to players, publishing vets list, etc.Very surprised and disappointed that some trainers/horsemens groups are not all that thrilled on the transparency issue.It looks like some just want players in the dark, like mushrooms with crap on their heads.It seems some believe that if players start to hear this stuff, the handle will go down, also, the loons will gain fodder.Loons aside, and while possibly true about the handle, is it fair to withhold what some players may feel is important information in deciding who to bet and how much?


Mike

[P-Dub]

magicnight Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not as bad as Mary Jo\'s trip, I reckon.


This just took the lead.

[sighthound]

A horse can have a \"ticking time bomb\", like sesamoids about to blow apart, that are visible on radiographs, but won\'t make the horse visibly lame or unable to pass a vet inspection.

Edit:  \"transparency\" most difficult to accomplish within the cheapest level of horses running, who have the most physical issues, and trainers just trying to make the mortgage with their string.

[sighthound]

Richiebee would win this price quarter after quarter, year after year.  Agreed.

[sighthound]

Touche ... well done.

[alm]

sighthound Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A horse can have a \"ticking time bomb\", like
> sesamoids about to blow apart, that are visible on
> radiographs, but won\'t make the horse visibly lame
> or unable to pass a vet inspection.
>
> Edit:  \"transparency\" most difficult to accomplish
> within the cheapest level of horses running, who
> have the most physical issues, and trainers just
> trying to make the mortgage with their string.


What if anything can be done for a sesamoid like that?  Can it ever heal in the way ordinary bones heal?