Parx 8th

[FrankD.]

I stopped on my way home today at one of the local hot spots where my uncle hangs out with the over 70 \" old school\" handicappers crowd.They still call the DRF the Armstrong! It\'s a bowling alley/OTB/bar & restaurant where Richiebee could get a bottle of Heinken for 3 bucks and Damon Runyon would have had a field day.

Anyway Monday & Tuesday are generally days where I work a 10-12 hour day as the wagering menu does nothing to entice here. I\'ll occasionally stop for lunch and throw in a pick 4 at Finger Lakes but Parx is on the Laurel, Pimlico, Delaware, Penn National excluded from wagering list here. I\'ll look at it once a year on Penn Derby Day and that\'s usually a mere glance.

My interest in stopping to see my uncle involved the Giants & Redskins game tonight and a move to attempt to balance the books a bit shall we say. However my 71 year old uncle who reads the DRf for hours a day for the past 50 years and rarely makes a bet over $20.00 jumped out of his seat as I came in and grabbed me; stating he was just about to call me. He found the lock double of the century in the Parx 7th & 8th and was as excited as a 5 yr old on Christmas morning.

He pointed out the 9 horse in the 7th race with some back class, 3rd start off a layoff and being wheeled back after a strong work at Bowie. He then started salvating that \"Tricky\" was wheeling one right back from NY in the 8th to steal the 30k winners share of slots money.

My conservative life long book maker uncle stated he was betting a $50.00 double and said I should do the same but no more as he did not want me to hurt his price.
So I obliged after a 5 minute look at his form. The 9 horse goes coast to coast banged from 9/2 to 3/1 after they left the gate and were alive. I didn\'t see the will pays as I was chatting about the senior crowd about my weekend trip to Michigan to visit my son and see his swim meet. To some you would swear I went to China as half of these guys have never left Schenectady, NY in their lives san a bus trip to a Yankee or Giant game.

So were off in the 8th and Charlie\'s Quest from the rail with the bug boy JL Ortiz drop back to last and my uncle is screaming it\'s a stiff job. I told him to relax and mentioned the notorious Philly dead rail and he and his 75 yr old gambling buddy looked at me like I just spoke Greek to them. A last to first 8 wide move had Charlie opening up a length on the fast closing 16/1 shot outside of him and Charlie started to drift out. The 7 horse was never going by him, he mainted a 1/2 lenght lead at all times as he carried out 3 or 4 paths in the final yards never making contact with the 7 horse.

Objection sign come up and no one is really concerend until they show and show and show the reply constantly for about 10 minutes. The God\'s of Philly didn\'t like Tricky coming in to steal the locals slot money and wanted to send a message.
DQ a reversal after about 15 minutes and a reply explanation of how the 1 horse never allowed the 7 to run in a straight path through the stretch.

Nonsense and trust me losing a $50 double that was maybe paying 30 bucks does not have me crying sour grapes. My uncle and his cronies are screaming fix and they wanted to teach Dutrow a lesson.

I\'ve been watching races for 39 years and this was as bogus a DQ as you will ever see. They never made contact, the 1 had a full length lead when he started to drift and the jock on the 7 whipped left handed the whole time.

The Philly God\'s do not have stalls to take from Tricky but they sent him a very loud message today that he is not welcome there to come in and take the slot pot de jour!!!!!!

A wagering travisty!!!!!!

Good luck,

Frank D.

[TreadHead]

I happened to be home from work this aftn and saw this race.  The 7 was a HUGE play on TG at the odds, having co-fastest figures going into the race and decent spacing as well as going for new connections with a decent record.

I made a WP wager and was OK with getting second and had no idea there was going to be an objection.  There have been far more questionable DQs than this one, the only reason it appears the 7 is never going by is because he is forced with a decision to run right into the ass of the 1 horse as he is about draw on terms, or get continually fanned out 3 or 4 paths from where he was originally racing, which is what ended up happening.

The jock on the 1 keeps whipping left handed despite how badly the horse is drifting out and never switches hands to try to correct him.

Were they trying to send a message to Dutrow?  Who knows, but I can tell you that the better horse on TG won and there is one bettor here who was happy for it.

[Kasept]

Oy vey Frank.. Ortiz herded Rivera out at least 5 paths. It\'s actually refreshing to see stewards punish that with a DQ. In NY, it goes completely un-addressed on a near daily basis.

[miff]

Hi Frank,

Poor Tricky,they\'re all dumping on him.

You would like to think that stewards are completely impartial as to who the rider/connections are when reviewing a foul claim.Did not see the race but from your comprehensive description,the no contact drifter is almost never a takedown in racing,esp if the whip is properly used.

Don\'t know why this type of no contact DQ is refreshing to anyone,unless they listen to a certain talking head.No contact fouls are often  too subjective to warrant a DQ,fine the jockey if appropriate.Every day at the racetrack you will see jocks  float their horses wide causing an opponent to lose ground, it\'s race riding.

Since the Stewards did not put up an inquiry,the DQ a little surprising, ugly beat,small or not.

Mike

[Boscar Obarra]

All this talk got me to look at the race. You can see the head on clearly at the replay section at xpressbet.

 This was an absolutely righteous dq, and even in NY would have come down.

 Funny thing is the winner starts out in the 8 path as the field is spread wide and winds up in the 15 path, having taken a right turn 50 yds from the wire. A slower drift might have gone unpunished, but if they left this one up,  it would have been absurd.

 There was actually little or no contact, but 45 degree running angles are frowned upon, even at PARX.

PS The #1 probably wins even without bothering the 7, but not by much.

[FrankD.]

Boscar,

I love ya!!!
BUT:
I believe your over stating a little here. Any DQ is subjective and open to interpatation for sure; as miff states expecially a non contact foul.
3 others above who watched the same race had the one moving out 3-5 paths not 7.
If Charlie did move out 7 paths in 50 yards he would have been running at a 45degree angle.That is clearly not the case and if it was that flagrant? Where was the Stweards Inquiry??? It was posted as an objection and took 15 minutes to reverse the ruling.

Bottom line IMHO it was a clear message to Tricky that he is not welcome to come in and pick the locals pockets.

Good luck,

FD

[miff]

At many venues,have seen most jockey claims, with no contact,stay up even when it looked possible that a takedown might be the call.Believe jockey claims are dismissed like 98% of the time.Stats anyone?

Think the mindset of stewards on non contact fouls is to let the results stand unless there is a flagrant check/steady/herd that caused a placing.Did not see the Parx issue but finishing in the 10 path or wherever is not relevant if there is no contact unless another horse is flanking the drifter and being herded out with the jock on the drifter persevering with his left hand.

[Kasept]

FrankD. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bottom line IMHO it was a clear message to Tricky
> that he is not welcome to come in and pick the
> locals pockets.
>
> Good luck,
>
> FD


Frank..

With all due respect, Rick Dutrow came in to the race 31/11-8-3 (35%) for the year at Philly. Start #32 was where they decided to send their message?

And for those curious, Tony Dutrow is 175/53-24-25 (30%)..

[Boscar Obarra]

The reason there was no contact is very likely that the other jock was actively avoiding it. Unless you think that two horses decided to visit the grandstand at the same time.

 This is the reason why herding is objectionable, it distracts the competition from moving forward.

[plasticman]

I didnt see the race and have no plans to, but here\'s my general feeling on DQs.

Pay the winner.

If i read a message board and there are 50% saying \'horrible DQ\' and 50% saying \"legit\" i have to feel that its bogus. Now, if 100% are saying \"no brainer dq\" than i could live with a dq.

Just the idea that SOMEONE is complaining about a DQ means to me, it was probably the judges playing god with the money that someone else legitimately won.

There\'s holding on every play in the NFL, but rarely called. If its something that could go \'either way\' pay off the winners and lets move on.

[Rich Curtis]

\" If its something that could go \'either way\' pay off the winners and lets move on.\"

  If something that \"could go either way\" starts going only one way, then it is no longer something that could go either way, which means the \"could go either way\" line will move to a different, more extreme place, and the same 50%-50% arguments will take place there.

[Boscar Obarra]

Using the contents of a message board to make judgments, well, about as useful as the old drf speed rating/variant.

 If they allow extreme herding , then every jock on the lead will deliberately drift when someone is coming.  You don\'t want that.

[TGJB]

In a TV interview after the 98 Belmont, Kent D. said he purposely brought Real Quiet out late to try to take away VG\'s path. The stewards said later they would have taken RQ down anyway, I\'m glad we didn\'t get to find out.

[richiebee]

That \"deliberate drift\" was used pretty effectively on almost a daily basis by a
jock that many say was the best ever to ride the NY circuit....

[plasticman]

Rich, my point was basically that if you can make any somewhat legitimate case for the horse to stay up, i think you should really leave the horse up and pay the winners.

Im all for DQs where everyone says \"geez, there was no way you could make any kind of real case to leave the horse up\".

Betting on winners is too hard to get the \'nitpick\' DQ. Make it legit and i\'m sure most horseplayers won\'t have a problem with it.