Proud Spell out of Breeders Cup

[Silver Charm]

You can not blame Larry Jones. This is Turf Racing not Dirt.

The BC did a great job of building a tremendous event over about 18 years and now is about to nearly kill it. The bad weather last year at Monmouth (which could not be helped) caused a drastic cut in wagering. This year will be worse. If its random people will play the lottery or slots.  

I would be looking for an escape clause somehwere in that contract with SA. \"Since your racing surface is not laid down today we must declare it unsafe and move elsewhere.\"

I would go to Belmont Park or CD on my knees begging saying stop me before I kill myself with a self inflicted wound.

[Silver Charm]

Maybe even go to  Stronach and say, let us out of the contract because it is in the best interest of the sport.

He is a reasonable man.........

[Delmar Deb]

I doubt that the track surface has anything to do with Mr. Jones decision not to race in California.  Just as I don\'t believe Pure Clan passed the Del Mar Oaks because she was too \"tired\" from her previous race.

[marcus]

that sire profile synth tgi falls off quite a bit and since debuting , she ran her second worst career figure on synth at keeneland .  my bet is they\'ll get squared away with the new racing surface and everyone will be happy - but i want a good price ...

[richiebee]

Whether or not surface considerations were an issue, this is the second
potential Eclipse Award winner who will not be running on the \"Pro Ride\",
joining, apparently, Curlin.

Hate to repeat myself, but Churchill or Belmont should consider running all of
their high purse graded dirt stakes on the last weekend in October.
Maybe \"collaborate\" and present a day of dirt racing which includes dirt racing
from both venues (though \"collaborate\" not a word frequently used by the
management of racing facilities in this country). Maybe run these races on the
Sunday after the BC races, though I know many think that competing with pro
football and baseball\'s World Series is futile.

Some folks out there might jump on me as a synthetic \"hater\", but that is not
the case. I just think that horsemen and horseplayers deserve options. If there
is going to be racing on 3 separate surfaces (Dirt, turf, synthetic) why not
allow for champions to perform on 3 separate surfaces?

Possible Future Scenario: In 2012, there are 2 outstanding older horses. Each
horse has won 3 Grade 1 stakes-- horse \"A\" has won 3 Gr 1s on synthetic, horse
\"B\" has won 3 Gr 1s on dirt. \"A\" and \"B\" have beaten equally respectable fields
and have run times close to the track records in their races. Neither one
of \"A\" or \"B\" races in the BC Classic, which is won by a rank outsider who does
not possess the credentials of either \"A\" or \"B\". Your Eclipse Award winning
Older Horse in this scenario is....? (or will there eventually be Eclipses
awarded for performers on both non-turf surfaces?)

[Of course, the Champion could be determined by who was awarded the lowest TG#
and TGJB could present the award]

If the BC ever returns to natural terra firma, I would have no problem
with a series of high purse graded races being run on a synthetic surface
on the same weekend as the BC dirt races.

Change is good, but so is having a choice. CD, NYRA, get to work on this right
away.

[mlnolan00]

Churchill can\'t run that last Saturday because those dates have already been given to Keeneland.  Maybe NYRA could run a few BIG turf races on Saturday and then when CD opens on Sunday the remaining DIRT races could be run then.

Also, everyone keeps mentioning the Clark as a potential showdown sport for Curlin & BB, but they keep forgetting that the Clark is a HANDICAP race and I believe Camp Curlin wants to keep running in weight-for-age races.

Hahaha, what\'s gonna happen when Big Brown loses the BC Classic to some donkey like Go Between...What a bunch of idiots at the Breeders Cup.

[fkach]

Richie,

I\'m not sure I like your idea of running dirt races \"against\" the BC. While I would like to see the dirt championships settled on dirt, I think it would be a divisive move that could damage the BC at a time when the industry needs to pull together on issues like drugs etc..

It wasn\'t very difficult to predict that a lot of top dirt horses weren\'t going to go to CA. The \"powers that be\" apparently aren\'t very insightful. However, I suspect they will learn their lesson when a 1/2 dozen or more US dirt stars don\'t show up and the Europeans win a couple of races on \"dirt\" with second tier \"turf\" horses.

[Silver Charm]

When a half a dozen US Dirt Stars do not show up???

Say What!! These are the best horses in their respective divisions if not the world. Their places will taken by wannabes and most of the races will unhandicappable.

I have not missed a BC or even a race for however long it has been around. What is going to occur this year is not the BC. This is the Synthetic World Championship of Racing. Not even the ESPN TV Crew can hype this as the Greatest Racing of All-Time. I will not be putting big money into this mess. Take the rubber band off a week later for the CalCup. Wait a minute the BC will look like the Cal Cup.

Speaking of ESPN when racing was lucky enough to get them signed up do you think ESPN knew what they were getting into.  

Don\'t give me all of the excuses of why this track doesn\'t have these dates or too many obstacles to overcome by switching now. They can get it done.

This mess can be avoided and there are four men who can see that it happens.

Jerry Brown
Len Friedman
Steve Crist
Andy Beyer

[Silver Charm]

Just curious. If the four men mentioned above withheld their handicapping data for the BC Card only..

How big of a dent would there be made in the overall handle for the BC Card?

30% or 50% or even 70%

Might be a bit of a dent in their own pockets but perhaps short lived. They don\'t have to wait a year to make it back.

And besides if they say wagering on something as random as this years BC racing surface will be is not in their customers best interests.

They may actually build more customer loyalty. Something the BC needs to learn a little about..........

[Delmar Deb]

I guess you haven\'t heard...the Cal Cup is October 5th!  And the 6 Grade I races including the Yellow Ribbon are September 27th.

[NoCarolinaTony]

Ladies and Gents,

There clearly is a bigger picture to all of this. CD is a  Magna partner so they ain\'t getting involved in a hostile take over of the BC and running anything on a all DIRT STAKES DAY. The NTRA folks are mostly from KY, and if you didn\'t read the fine print, KEE and the LEX HARD BOOTS and looking at a redesign to get the BC, perhaps the new PERM home. Stay tuned.

And when the day finally comes and all the whining is done, I am sure most of you folks claiming to be withholding their money will just not be able to resist the temptation to play racing\'s biggest day. even if it\'s just the turf races, but I am sure you\'ll dabble.

Wagering on Syn-th is a different strategy than dirt, but not all that different, and one can adjust to it, with an open mind.

But in the mean time, you all open up a bottle of red or a bottle of white, it  depends upon your appetite.....just don\'t forget the provolone.....

NC Tony

[P-Dub]

Silver Charm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> I would go to Belmont Park or CD on my knees
> begging saying stop me before I kill myself with a
> self inflicted wound.


Some of us are saying this to you if we have to read yet another rant about the Breeders\' Cup.  You don\'t like synthetic racing, we get it already.  

Do you think it takes us reading 500 posts on the same subject before we get it?? Dude, stop already. Geez.

You are quickly surpassing Chuckles The Clown as far as being both obnoxious and ridiculous. Suggesting Jerry, Len, Beyer, and Crist withold information for the BC hoping that handle declines 50%.  Sure, that will happen. There are many resources for handicapping besides those you mentioned.

I\'m not even going to mention the many other Clown-like posts you\'ve authored.

Do you ever have anything positive to say, or do you spend all friggin day figuring out a new way to bitch about something?? Like I said before, I\'ll be at Santa Anita having a great time. Thank God you won\'t be there.

[Silver Charm]

>Suggesting Jerry, Len, Beyer, and Crist withold information for the BC hoping >that handle declines 50%.

I never suggested they would be hoping it declined 50%. I just implied that it might. And if it did then maybe some of these people making these uncustomer friendly decisions might go to them first and say \"what do you and your customers think?\" As in help us because we are clueless decision making idiots and you understand the handicapper and the sport better than we do.

>There are many resources for handicapping besides those you mentioned.

None that are so widely accepted, respected or that consistently work.

I rest my case...........

[APny]

P-dub,

While I can respect you being annoyed by all the negative posts about the Breeders Cup...it\'s people like you that are the problem...people who are just willing to sit back and accept the demise of the sport.  The Breeders cup is one of the very few chances for the best of the best in each division to face off...If nobody is willing to stand up as customers..nothing will ever change...and the sport will continue to be run by suits who don\'t keep the customer in mind when making decisions. You can\'t really argue that this will be a real breeders cup...with so many good horses staying home.  I was laughing last year at Monmouth because Sam Houston put a big ad in the program wanting to be considered to host the event.  I thought it was funny...but now I believe more of the top horses would have shown up there than at Santa Anita this year.  Kind of sad.

[jma11473]

I\'m torn on this, because I do agree that the synthetic Breeders Cup is going to be a mess. However, the DRF and Thoro-Graph witholding their information would only ruin their business, not stop the Breeders Cup from being placed wherever the powers that be want it placed. It\'s not going to ruin the Breeders Cup forever either...so let\'s not go crazy. There are a lot bigger problems in racing than where they hold these races. Jerry, Crist, etc. would be better off putting their efforts into cleaning up the drug problem (or continuing to do so), for example, than holding a Breeders Cup protest.