Lucky Pulpit vs. Tapit

[jimbo66]

I am old.  My memory is failing me.

What prop?

Besides, based on Jim\'s comment about General Arod\'s sheet, sounds like a two foot putt for you......

[TGJB]

Artie v Midnight Hawk at 1 1/4 on dirt.

[miff]

\'They should have trained him up to the derby and he would have been great value\'

Wrong,

They tried the 8 week route with Cairo Prince into the Fl Derby and the horse was dull,lacking his usual sharp run.Very tough to keep a horse racing sharp,8 weeks out.Normally that route taken for horses of lighter frames or smallish that cannot stand up physically to a tough TC campaign.Also some go over the top way too early(see TAP 1-38 in Derby with his early 3yr old GP rockets)

Critical to the depth of the Derby that Cairo Prince, Social Inclusion and Bayern get in, imo but long shot they do. All legit fast compared to some of the slugs that will enter the gates if they don\'t get in.


Mike

[TGJB]

First of all, they gave CP 8 weeks into his previous race, and he ran a new top. And he didn\'t run that far off his top last time.

There are is some chance they got caught up in the hype with this one. Nothing wrong with the layoff if you want the big effort(s) to come later-- but they may have thought he was good enough to win without being tight, which is another story.

Preakness might be unusually interesting this year. This is a very deep crop.

[Michael D.]

re CC\'s pedigree -

On top it\'s Pulpit over Cozzene over the 2nd dam of Unbridled\'s Song. On bottom it\'s a full to Travers winner Rhythm over Danzig (with Rhythm\'s brilliant female family showing up again) over Sir Ivor over Vaguely Noble over Ribot over Princequillo. Before that you see Judy-Rae, the one that got the whole Courtly Dee thing going.  The average winning distance on both  top and bottom is short, but I think it\'s been established that CC is not your average Lucky Pulpit/Not for Love, so it might be best to focus on some of the other influences. A few years back folks tossed Union Rags from serious triple crown consideration because of the Dixie Union, when it was pretty clear that UR was not your average Dixie Union.

Does anybody see specific Lucky Pulpit/Not For Love characteristics in CC that might matter once he tries 10f over a more demanding track?

[covelj70]

and there was a time when people (myself included) argued that Distorted Humor\'s didn\'t want the classic distances

A Derby and a Belmont and BC Classic win later, no one worried about that anymore

note I may be making same mistake on Tapit now but point is that people\'s view on pedigree tends to be very much an arm chair quarterback point of view

and oh by the way, Boundry wasn\'t you\'re classic derby sire either!

[covelj70]

I meant Monday morning quarterback.  sorry!

[TGJB]

Jim-- Given the source, I bumped my head when I fainted after reading that.

[miff]

\'And he didn\'t run that far off his top\'


FL derby figure for CP saved by ground loss,horse was without his usual run when asked. Performance a huge disappointment to trainer/jockey/owner,regardless of fig.They thought first or second for sure.CP on the smaller side and that plus Kiaran drinking the Kool Aid with the ridiculous top on Rags,equalled 8 week.The prior 8 weeks was 2 to 3 development time and winter TC run break.

Agree,if several of the fast ones dont get in derby,Preakness may be a deeper race.Social,Cairo want in Derby,Bayern may earn ticket Sat.


Rags had Cali Chrome going in with a top of like TG 2.5.If a horse wires over there,he\'s probably slow.. Brilliant!

[covelj70]

lol

very good

listen, I am always trying to learn and learn from my prior mistakes, that\'s half the fun of all of this for me

since you never make any mistakes, you don\'t have that opportunity (he says with a wink)!

[TGJB]

Jim-- I have made mistakes. You just weren\'t around when I made them.

One involved a horse called Elite Mercedes. I agreed with Walden about running him on 2 weeks rest in the Arkansas Derby off an effort, a) not realizing until after the entries came out he would spot weight under the then allowance conditions, which cost him second and the earnings he needed for the Derby, and b) after running on short rest the horse got hurt and was never the same.

And I\'m haunted to this day by the idea that running License Fee in the Molly Pitcher, 3rd start in 5 weeks, cost that great mare her life. She had won about 5 in a row, was 3/5, it was an easy spot... she died on the track.

[Wrongly]

Jim

Good to see you as well.  Did you nominate Testa Rossi to the Edgewood and if so do you plan to enter?

Around these parts I\'m the lone Uconn fan, but I\'m hoping for a repeat of 2004 where both men and women won the championship.

[miff]

\"Does anybody see specific Lucky Pulpit/Not For Love characteristics in CC that might matter once he tries 10f over a more demanding track?\"

Mike D,

Think that characteristic would have shown already.Under the microscope, CC won on Cushion,Poly,Dirt and really improved once he added lasix/blinkers and fronts came off.Seems to not need a certain surface, CD is quirky though.

Over the next few weeks,all kinds of theories will surface championing some slug while knocking the obvious fast ones....its part of the Derby tradition.

Good luck,

Mike

[TGJB]

Mike-- my girlfriend grew up in Storrs. We walked over to the campus once. Lot more cows than people up there.

I once played golf up there and as it happens was paired with the guy whose job it was to make sure the athletes passed all their tests.

[richiebee]

>
> I once played golf up there and as it happens was
> paired with the guy whose job it was to make sure
> the athletes passed all their tests.

Academic or urine?

More seriously (much) hoping for a full and speedy recovery for Steven Crist, who was hospitalized after suffering cardiac arrest yesterday.