Author Topic: Wicked Strong  (Read 2363 times)

covelj70

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Wicked Strong
« on: April 26, 2014, 04:31:49 AM »
I was able to get out to Belmont yesterday morning and watch his breeze

Beautiful morning out there. I also got to see Testa Rossi train as well as Swift Warrior so Friday morning was just about my perfect morning

Bottom-line is that I loved what I saw from Wicked Strong and he is my play for the Derby

I was very surprised that it was just me and one other gentlemen (who I didn\'t know) that were waiting for the horse to come out of the barn and walk with him to the track. It\'s a short walk from the Jerkins barn 57 to the training track at Belmont but given all of the concerns people have about this horse being high strung, etc, I wanted to see what he was like before his breeze. Now, its beyond apples and oranges to compare Belmont on a quiet Friday morning with 2 of us following along to what he will face next Sat but I will say that if I didn\'t know the horse had a reputation for being high strung, I wouldn\'t have thought twice about it as nothing he did before, during or after his breeze suggested the slightest hint of this horse acting like a knucklehead

It\'s clear the barn takes meticulous steps to make things as easy as possible on the horse mentally including the fact that they have a stable pony walk to and from the track with him. The stable pony is just about the calmest horse I have ever seen and you can tell his disposition positively effects Wicked Strong. The stable pony came out of the barn about 2 minutes before Wicked and stood perfectly still while the rider laid on his belly with his feet flat out and hands at the side like Superman. This is relevant to nothing other than I thought it was cool but the main point is this horse has clearly been a very calming influence on WS because WS didn\'t show the slightest hint of anxiousness or anxiety at any point to or from the track.

In terms of the breeze itself, everyone can see from the video how well this horse moves. He\'s a great moving horse who is clearly feeling happy and healthy. He\'s carrying good weight. He\'s a tall horse, medium build. Looks just like Hard Spun to me but I\'m not an expert on such things. I watched the breeze along with the assistant trainer who is terrific guy. Easy to root for these folks. Needless to say, they were extremely happy with the way the horse breezed. One note on breezes for people who are newer to the game that is valuable here. You often here that the time of the breeze doesn\'t tell the whole story. This is a good example of that for several reasons. First, the breeze started at the half mile pole before the turn for home and the breeze didn\'t end at the finish line, instead, the horse continued to breeze past the wire and finished 3/8ths past the wire around the turn. So one might want to compare the final 3/8ths of one of the breezes later this am at Churchill to the 37.55 final 3/8ths from WS yesterday and say \"not so good\" but since WS\'s final 3/8ths were around a turn, the times aren\'t comparable (not to mention the differences in track surfaces, etc).

The other important factor in the breeze for me was his ability to relax early and finish strong. Not just from a stamina perspective because we already know the horse has that but horses that have been knocked out by a previous effort or who aren\'t feeling good physically will often go fast early and then slow down late. Sort of the equivalent of \"wanting to get it over with\". This horse was the exact opposite. Very relaxed early, very powerful late. Watching the way this horse finishes the final 3/8ths around the turn and then gallops out another 1/8th tells you this is a true route horse. Watch his two  1  1/8 races. This horse doesn\'t even start running until the 1/8th pole.

The final question for me was seeing how hard he was breathing after the breeze so I rushed back to the barn to meet the horse (they come off the training track to head back to the barn from a different chute than they come onto to track so I couldn\'t walk back along with him). This horse couldn\'t have blown out a match and he was ready to do alot more than what he did was my main takeaway on that front. I had a chance to chat briefly with the rider that breezed him and all impressions are that this horse is doing as well as he\'s ever done

I posted some pictures on twitter (@covelj) for anyone who wants to see the horse heading to the track before the breeze or coming back after

Sorry I wasn\'t able to post this yesterday. I rushed to work right from Belmont and then I coached my sons baseball game right after work (barn burner ended in a 7-7 tie for those keeping score at home). Then took kids to dinner, came home, watched the hockey games and collapsed!

There are a million things that could go wrong for Wicked Strong pre race or during the race but I think this horse is by far the most likely winner.

He\'s the fastest horse in the race on the only speed figures I care about, he\'s one of the two best breed horses for the distance, I confirmed for myself yesterday that he\'s coming into the race in absolutely great shape and his running style seems to fit the race shape of this years derby very well

Any of these horses are liable to have a tough time dealing with the crowd so that\'s a concern for all of them, WS included, and I wish he had a jock that had won the race before but Rajiv rode MMM fine a few years ago in this race and he handled the pressure of big races well with Groupie Doll so I am ok there

I will be very surprised if he doesn\'t hit the board and that\'s how I will be playing the race. Very heavy with him on top and then keying him in the tri and super.

Good luck to all, will be a great week as always.

jbelfior

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2014, 07:37:18 AM »
Perhaps another Pleasant Colony in a year where Wildcat Red and General A Rod remind me of Proud Appeal and Cure The Blues.

Good Luck,
Joe B

heatherk

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2014, 08:01:23 AM »
Thanks Jim. How did your horses work SW and TR?

shanahan

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2014, 08:04:41 AM »
jbelfior Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Perhaps another Pleasant Colony in a year where
> Wildcat Red and General A Rod remind me of Proud
> Appeal and Cure The Blues.
>
> Good Luck,
> Joe B


I only wish \"Cure the Blues\" was running in Chicago on sunday....

louisvilleguy1111

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2014, 08:52:10 AM »
As always super post. I don\'t you from Adam but just reading your posts you seem like a complete gentleman and a really cool guy. Nice to hear the horse came out of the Wood in good order. Thank you.

richiebee

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #5 on: April 26, 2014, 09:38:17 AM »
Jim:

Really appreciate the observations, and that you took time from a busy schedule
to post them. A little disappointed you couldn\'t get over to Aq to watch Saamraat
work, but I understand.

As you mention this fella has the reputation of being a bit of a head case and
his demeanor at CD leading up to the race and race day will be important to his
chances.

ajkreider

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2014, 09:48:11 AM »
Thanks you for the report.  Was kinda hoping to hear something that suggested he was a bounce candidate, but so much for that.

Did you get to see Uncle Sigh?  He apparently put in a 5/8th work that went out 7f in about the same time as Wicked Strong.

miff

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2014, 09:48:16 AM »
WS actually worked a mile in like 1.40 with 7f going 1.27, lots of 13\'s for eighths, trainer happy with work.The Chief would work horses like that also, definitely looks the stayer, a bit short on brilliance though.
miff

pres711

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2014, 09:48:34 AM »
mr C: I just want to express my appreciation for your your willingness to share your personal observations with members of the Board and your infectious spirit and and \"derby fever\" which I have had symptoms of myself since\'72. The TG Board is by far the best place to be in the weeks leading up to the Derby and your posta  are a big part of that.  

My future wagers on CC have made me biased towards him aided by watching Espinoza choking down on him the last 1/16th in his last two open length wins.  Doesn\'t appear to be one who can\'t get another 1/8th (his breeder says he won\'t have a problem but I guess that\'s to be expected.  I am not sure that the CW is correct that there will be a fast pace.  The likely speed WR and VIT have to back it down to have any chance to win.  A slower fiest 1/4 will bunch them up and create traffic for the deep closers.  That\'s why this is such a great race year after year, you never know for sure how things will play out.  Also, why do you think a bounce is not in the cards off that big top?  Enough of my rambling.

Good luck with all your plays , may they all come home safely.

TreadHead

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #9 on: April 26, 2014, 09:57:18 AM »
This is really important detailed perspective.  Twitter is a disaster over today\'s works so far, with half people saying all the works were MEH, B, B+ works at best and there is no sign of the \"blow me away\" work we have seen in year\'s past.  And then other folks talking up Candy Boy and calling it \"work of the morning\".   Hard to know who to believe.

covelj70

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2014, 11:05:43 AM »
All,

Thanks for all of the nice comments

lousiville, I really appreciate those kind words. Means alot.

Shannahan, SW and TR just galloped yesterday. They will breeze this weekend. SW had his big breeze last weekend in preparation for the Ft. Marcy. He should run very well. He\'s doing great. This is the race we were pointing for all winter and John Terranova has done an awesome job having him primed for this.

richie, thanks for being you!

Aj, I don\'t really believe in bounces and when a horse looks and acts and breezes like WS did yesterday (best part of breeze was last 3/8ths), I really don\'t worry about some made up bounce theories. He may not win for a bunch of reasons but its not going to be because of a bounce. Look at the Oaks probable TGs if you bought then and look at Room Service. She\'s not running in Oaks but look at her figs before she got to run 1 1/8 in the GP stake and then what she ran in that race. Huge jump up. She supposed to bounce in the Ashland based on that big jump, right? Nope, instead she moved forward big time again in the Ashland. I knew we were in trouble with Testa Rossi in the paddock of the Ashland because Room Service looked absolutely incredible. You can typically tell from a physical inspection if a horse is going backwards. Room Service looked the exact opposite in the Ashland and Wicked Strong looked that way yesterday.

No one impressed too much at CD this am. Tomorrow another big round of works down there.

Good luck

pizzalove

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #11 on: April 26, 2014, 12:43:57 PM »
I dont know what is so made up about bounce theories.  I will admit it is an inexact science.  But so is horse racing.  I will tell you that being a former race horse owner myself I put alot less stock in appearance.  I dont doubt for a minute that WS looked great when you saw him and worked wonderfully.  I will also tell you that in the KD 80 to 90 of the horses will work great and with a high energy level.  That is why out of tens of thousands of three year old thoroughbreds only 20 run in the Derby.  Derby horses tend to look great.

I can tell you plenty of Derby mistakes I have made based on a horses appearance or how they work prior to the derby.  I thought storm treasure may have been the best horse I have ever seen.  Just perfect looks and size.  Laid an egg on the first may saturday.  

I was four feet from M. Matz who was sitting on a horse with leather chaps when a horse was working toward the finish line.  Effortless smooth brilliant looking runner.  I asked \"who the hell was that?\".  Matz told me it was \"union rags\".  I did not recognize him because i cant even begin to tell you the unbelieveable difference between seeing a horse on Tv and seeing it live.  I bet with both hands.  Rags lost in the Derby easily.

even Earlier on some of my larger exactas I took out Invisible ink and replaced him with the gourgeous Congaree.  Mistake.  Wife didnt talk to me for awhile after that one.

Is Wicked Strong a nice looking colt? Certainly.  But if you knew nothing of the race records and Candy boy, Dance with Fate, and Wicked Strong were led into a sales ring I guarantee both of those horses would bring back more than WS. And so would others.

On the bounce angle I dont know of a horse that worked harder in their race than WS.  Ridden hard and fully extended and not a particulary straight stretch run.  I completely acknowledge I could be wrong here but a matching top is the best you can root for here in my opinion and I dont think it is likely.  If he does match he is in there but I just dont like it.  Also throw in his perfect ground saving trip and u could argue a very weak wood field. (Saamraat a toss for me). I just cant see playing this obvious second choice at 5 or 6-1.

As for the breeding I was never a big fan of Hard Spun.  To say this is the second best bred horse in this field is reaching.  Hard Spun had a mildly successful triple crown series because he was like the lone speed each time.  I thought there would be more speed in the derby but Larry was the only one smart enough to tell them to go for the lead and it appeared he would steal it until trounced by Street Sense.  If only he had followed this strategy in the Belmont.  It was somewhat of an off track that year as well in the Derby.

I do like the jock and trainer.

TGJB

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #12 on: April 26, 2014, 12:45:37 PM »
My tongue is bleeding...
TGJB

ajkreider

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #13 on: April 26, 2014, 12:50:05 PM »
Thanks Jim,

I agree that if his last effort took too much out of him, we\'d see it in weight loss or some such.  So your visual take means a lot.

There is a pattern similarity with Room Service for sure. But there are jump ups and then there are jump ups.  Wicked Strong\'s was twice what Room Service improved, and was even greater than both of her forward moves combined.  If he doesn\'t react to that, he might be something special.  Would love to have reason to toss him, as the likely 2nd choice - so on that score your report makes things tougher.

louisvilleguy1111

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Re: Wicked Strong
« Reply #14 on: April 26, 2014, 12:53:51 PM »
The one thing I worry about WS is his trainer and being able to ship and win a race like the KY Derby. I know his father was legendary, but stats are stats and Jimmy\'s stats in this area leave something to be desired. I def see Wicked Strong running a bang up race and possibly being right there in the final furlong but win the race?? I am not so sure.... But def think he would be a very popular winner of the roses and if he does win would def be pulling for him in the next too races to be our 12th Triple Crown winner.