He Came Home In 24 and 1.

[ringato3]

Make it 7 last place horses.

Didn\'t notice Matterhorn ran last in the nightcap..

Ugh

Rob

[Fairmount1]

You are mentioning very controversial things here.  Tread lightly.  

People on the board believe every photo and close race he wins is a result of having the best horses.  Every race he finishes dead last is b/c it is a matter of percentages that will put a horse there......

[jp702006]

Did you say snots or shots?

[jerry]

Pace or no pace, weak field or not, 2:26 and change is real racehorse time. I\'m a believer.

[Flighted Iron]

Fraud-sted was ok

Read all your posts. get a kick out of many.I admire your straighforward dissension towards the political garbage and misdirection.However,Frosted imo
is a whole bunch better than ok.In fact,imo he\'s a serious racehorse with serious racetrack spirit.Btw,he\'s real fast on mostly everyone\'s stuff.

Belmont Stakes: Having the ability to \"run all day\". \"test of champions\".

Scoreboard: Frosted second best while running outside his own,personal,individual,idiosyncratic and preferred style.

With the \"of course\" provisions given, imo Frosted makes a huge splash in the
fall.

On a mutual note, i hope racing aquires a leader/leaders who vanquishes the insidious,money grubbing force and elevates Horseracing while maintaining singleminedly the most important aspect. El Caballos!


Best to you,
Flighted(mike).

[mjellish]

Frosted also checked midway on the 2nd turn in the midst of making his rally when Mub came out off the rail.  Frosted then got back into stride, dropped down to the rail and took off again.  Haven\'t heard anyone mention that yet.

He wouldn\'t have gotten by the winner no matter what IMO.  But he clearly ran the 2nd best race yesterday in the Belmont.

[miff]

Iron,


Thanks. No slug designation for Fraud-sted but not sure he\'s got upside, the tie back always a concern.Being fair, thought he got a great Belmont trip, nice position on slow pace but got run away from by AP.Guess he\'s top 5-6 of 3yr olds at this point but he needs help up front, me thinks.

All top 3yr olds were battered by AP, see how they come back.

Best,
Mike

[ringato3]

Mike

Nobody in same league as AP yesterday, so I was surely wrong with my view that frosted and materiality were good plays.  And I paid a dear price \"wasting\" slumber in the pick 4.

That said, will strongly disagree with frosted getting a great trip.   Closer, in and amongst a bunch of crowded horses during first quarter mile as best horse set a dawdling pace.   Then moved to rail by rosario, only to get shut off and lose momentum as Mjellish pointed out.  

Not Rosario\'s fault, unless he should have been aware that Pletcher was gonna crap out with another fast horses and materiality wasn\'t even going to be able to keep up to a 49 half.   Joel left for position but because pace so slow, he go caught in a crowd.

Lots of slamming of Kent on keen ice.   Guess I can. See that, but when the pace dawdles and the field clumps, horses get caught wide s d jockeys can\'t do much.  Didn\'t see a ton of chance for Kent to tuck and save ground.

Also think frosted ran a much better race than keen ice despite what the figures will say.   He took a run at AP after losing his momentum, and then AP broke his heart with a burst of speed, while keen ice clunked up after the race was over.  Frosted wasn\'t stopping, AP just ran away from him.  

Rob

[miff]

Rob,

Picky, picky,most would pay money for that cozy trip.In and amongst horses is much better on grass but they were crawling on that glib surface.Mini stop by Fraud during crawl fest not of any consequence imo, don\'t finish an inch closer without it.

Reasonable argument that if you switch trips between Fraud and Keen, maybe Keen beats him to wire. Keen looked dead approaching turn, no idea what drunk was doing.

The horrific performance by Mat kinda ruined the race when no pressure was put on AP. There were some mini uncomfortable trips but wouldn\'t give mulligans.

Mike

[Flighted Iron]

Guess he\'s top 5-6 of 3yr olds at this point but he needs help up front, me thinks.

Miff,
 
 Aside from AP who are the 3-4 that are better?

flighted

[miff]

Iron,

\"Better\" is subjective. On their best days, prefer Upstart, Firing Line, Dortmund to Fraud-sted, not that they are far apart.All three more tactical and can make their own race.

Numbers hardly tell the whole story,pro-active horses with equal figs to reactive horses will dominate, all else equal.


Mike

[Flighted Iron]

Miff,

 If you\'re speaking about a \"better\" wager vs. actual measured ability then
i might be inclined to agree/disagree depending on odds. Gambling is speculation and race dynamics certainly can be abstract. Speed types don\'t always make the lead and closers don\'t always lose ground/get stopped.

Firing line,Upstart and Frosted all tied for 2nd best imo. Dortmund somewhat
overrated.

Flighted Iron

[FrankD.]

Didn\'t Dortmund beat Firing Line twice and finish just behind him in the Derby after doing the dirty work on a dead rail or disadvantaged inner path if you will?

[miff]

Iron,

It\'s possible that Dortmund was not 100% for Derby/Preak, somewhat weakened by colic, perhaps a mulligan, perhaps a fraud.

Was not referring to odds vs figs etc.As far as running styles, horses closer at the pace call at all distances, dominate closers in wins by a wide margin.

Frosted next closest to FL in their races with AP

Mike

[Flighted Iron]

Dortmund and Firing line very close earlier. Dortmund hasn\'t progressed. Imo he needs front end bias,concrete type dirt racetrack.Fwiw ground loss imo is an excuse most time than not.A real( hate using this term)\"classy\" horse can handle many surfaces/adjust running style somewhat.

Re Frosted: Somewhat subjective and based on how well he ran visually and figuratively after the surgery,imo he wins FOY stakes if 1.surgery performed
prior. 2.blinks trimmed back.

Flighted iron